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Cleric

Crews, Highschool, performances, future.

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Glad to see that you understand and respect our views. The best thing that I can advise you to do, is to stay away from glowsticking in school. Attend meetups in your area. Speaking of, where do you live? Have you checked out the Regional section? Meetups are awesome. It's a great way to meet other members, and a great place to learn! I seem to always pick up a new move at a meetup. Let me know where you live, and I can tell you who your regional rep is and give you some more info if you want.

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Everything you say is 100% True and respected. There is no reason anyone should stand out against this.

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Glad to see that you understand and respect our views. The best thing that I can advise you to do, is to stay away from glowsticking in school. Attend meetups in your area. Speaking of, where do you live? Have you checked out the Regional section? Meetups are awesome. It's a great way to meet other members, and a great place to learn! I seem to always pick up a new move at a meetup. Let me know where you live, and I can tell you who your regional rep is and give you some more info if you want.

 

I live in Spring Hill, Florida. Not too far from Tampa. As for my lack of activity on these forums, I kinda forgot about GSC after I registered for like a year, but I'm back now. :whistle: My glowsticking interest has been reignited and now I'm anxious to learn new moves and develop my own style. :lol:

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i really like this post. all very well put. one thing though about talent shows and stuff... this is a talent. as long as there arnt any other glowstickers in it, then why care? and so what if someone picks it up? not EVERYONE picks it up to be cool. shit, i wouldnt have picked up this amazing art and be in this amazing culture if not for someone else who showed me. why not spread the love? its not selling out the art, because people will either drop it after awhile after they get bored or think plur is stupid, but there will be some who pick up glowstringing and learn about plur...and it could (and most likely will) change their lives for the better. please if you have something to comment, have it be nice. i respect everything people here say, and i agree mostly with what you have to say, but sometimes i think this site wants to hide glowsticking from the world. i think it should be shared.

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i really like this post. all very well put. one thing though about talent shows and stuff... this is a talent. as long as there arnt any other glowstickers in it, then why care? and so what if someone picks it up? not EVERYONE picks it up to be cool. shit, i wouldnt have picked up this amazing art and be in this amazing culture if not for someone else who showed me. why not spread the love? its not selling out the art, because people will either drop it after awhile after they get bored or think plur is stupid, but there will be some who pick up glowstringing and learn about plur...and it could (and most likely will) change their lives for the better. please if you have something to comment, have it be nice. i respect everything people here say, and i agree mostly with what you have to say, but sometimes i think this site wants to hide glowsticking from the world. i think it should be shared.

 

 

We are doing a shit job of hiding it from the world. This site garners thousands of hits per day.

 

We don't want it whored out to the world. We could easily push our online promotions team to double the sites hits quickly. But would that be the best thing? To do a mass exposure of the art? or take steps like we are to show more and more people on a smaller scale where we can actually try to educate them about the art and where it comes from.

 

 

Now based on what I do know of you. I would make the assumption you aren't the type of person who has been going to raves for years and years (What kind of scene does Michigan have?). I would also assume that you may not fully know what PLUR is beyond the acronym, like you haven't experienced it at a party and actually felt it. Also you may not understand why the underground should stay underground.

 

Those are assumptions. I'm more then prepared for you to tell me im completely wrong.

 

 

A lot of the things this site speaks of may not make full sense to younger individuals (generalizing) but when you get older and gain more knowledge of the scene, it's past present and future and the arts contained within....you see things a little differently and will understand why we don't promote talent shows and glowsticking in highschool.

 

 

 

 

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Ugh will people please stop using PLUR as a defense, attack, excuse or reason for everything? Yes, I understand the concept; yes, at one time I used it...but it gets thrown out there like it is the Bible to the Jewish faith (yep get the analogy). It isn't the answer to all your prayers and the concept of being a "nice" person in everyday life shouldn't come from PLUR.

 

I'm gonna write a rant about this later when I'm good and bored at home...

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i really like this post. all very well put. one thing though about talent shows and stuff... this is a talent. as long as there arnt any other glowstickers in it, then why care? and so what if someone picks it up? not EVERYONE picks it up to be cool. shit, i wouldnt have picked up this amazing art and be in this amazing culture if not for someone else who showed me. why not spread the love? its not selling out the art, because people will either drop it after awhile after they get bored or think plur is stupid, but there will be some who pick up glowstringing and learn about plur...and it could (and most likely will) change their lives for the better. please if you have something to comment, have it be nice. i respect everything people here say, and i agree mostly with what you have to say, but sometimes i think this site wants to hide glowsticking from the world. i think it should be shared.

 

I hate to say it, but you are also taking a rather rosey view in regards to the outcome of doing this at a talent show. Yes, in this hypothetical talent show, there might not be another glowsticker/stringer so it could be argued that you aren't competing against them. But from I remember, a good portion of said shows also happen to be competitions. And even if this one in particular isn't, you are still putting yourself up on a stage, a pedestal if you would, and are essentially showing off. That in and off itself could be viewed as an ego factor. Now lets take the opposite end of the coin to what you suggested with this knowledge in mind. Someone does happen to see what you are doing and they get interested in glowsticking/stringing, but for the wrong reasons. The reason they get interested in it is that they want to essentially show off. They practice, start getting good, and begin to show off. Sure, lets say that maybe most of the people they show off to don't think anything of it, but a few people do. This boosts that person's ego. In addition, those people that do think something of it think "hey, why can't I do this?". That mentality starts to spread like a virus. More people pick it up, wanting to have their own egos inflated. Eventually, people do start battling. And eventually, crews will be formed. Now lets also be realistic about this and say that not everyone who picks this up is doing it for the sake of their own egos and actually doing it for the fun of it. However, they don't know anything about this site or the community and culture behind it. All they know is this general "ego inflation" mind set that their local glowsticking culture has adopted. One of three things will probably happen. The first, they will get discouraged because battlers tend to be dicks to anyone not in their crew *I am sorry if I offended anyone who used to be a battler, but this is based on my own personal experience* and drop it. Second, they might eventually start battling themselfs. And third..... and this tends to not be that common from my own experience, they are stubborn about it and continue to only do it for fun, not caring about egos and such. Eventually, they do some research online and might stumble onto this site, or even accidently find a member in their area. And sure, those that picked it up for the wrong reasons might even drop it after the fad is no longer getting them the attention/ego inflation that they crave, or maybe they even grow up and no longer need to rely upon such shallow reassurances of their own personal self worth. But by that point, the damage has been done to that local scene in general.

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i think the area i come from has a lot to do with my opinions. i have never once met anyone in a crew, previously in a crew, or who has battled. im sure if i knew some people that did this to be cool, i would be mad. but i have never once met someone who does it to be cool. all the people i spin either poi or glowsticks with is very chill. hositility is something ive never recieved from a glowstringer.

 

and to cleric...michigan has a pretty nice scene. im not sure if sure if you are aware...but detriot is not all hiphop. shit, detriot has some deep techno roots man. but the scene here....its not massive but i like it a lot, you get to know or reconize a lot of the people who rave.

for gods sake man, im not saying go rent a billboard and advertise, not at all. im not saying go string in highschool, not at all. im not saying go string at a talent show, but i think a little bit of overeaction is happening. like any stringing someone does outside of a rave is like selling it outto fucing mtv.

 

second edit: , somehow i missed that whole insult about plur. i have never felt it? what the fuck man, who are you to judge me? you know nothing of me. assumtions do you no good, especially if that assumtion is being made off a single post i made. did i not say i liked your post? i agreed with about 90% of it. well shit, have you been in the rave scene since acid house? if not, please stop acting like you have superiority over me, like you know more than me, or that you opinions are better.

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i think the area i come from has a lot to do with my opinions. i have never once met anyone in a crew, previously in a crew, or who has battled. im sure if i knew some people that did this to be cool, i would be mad. but i have never once met someone who does it to be cool. all the people i spin either poi or glowsticks with is very chill and completly plur. hositility is something ive never recieved from a glowstringer, so you guys say that people pick it up to be cool, or people get in crews and exclude everyone else, its like....i cant believe it b/c i have never seen it.

 

And that's honestly completely understandible. Most of our own personal opinions happen to come from our own experiences. Hence why you will often hear "vets" saying to someone who's never experienced a rave that they need to experience one, or something similar, in order to understand where the culture is coming from. At the same time, you have to take it at face value for those of us who have experienced the things which we warn against. I've personally witnessed a scene go to hell down here and it take years to rebuild because of battlers. Other members on this site have been former battlers themselfs. Some have seen what talent shows can do or what showing off in public can do. And it's off of those combined experiences that often times these opinions are formed. Dave, Cleric, the rest of the staff, they aren't saying this stuff to be dicks, but to prevent the mistakes of the past from being repeated. Cause really, it sucks to see a scene self destruct. Especially when it could have been avoided.

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To each his own choice. We provide an option for teaching the way we believe will foster growth the best long term. The past repeats like lessons of childhood. Lessons have been learned and from this, the site has grown to not repeat past mistakes that have destroyed other communities. This community is not meant for everyone, but it is meant for people who want to share the bond that progresses us forward.

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have you been in the rave scene since acid house?

 

"since acid house" meaning the 80's or the 90's?

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but i think a little bit of overeaction is happening. like any stringing someone does outside of a rave is like selling it outto fucing mtv.

 

 

This isn't over reaction. We have meetups in public parks , rent out dance studios, practice in our backyards. None of which are raves.

 

 

I said I was more then ready for you to tell me wrong about my assumptions.

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I also think you took the "insult" way more as an insult then it was intended.

 

If you had been part of the underground scene during the time it got highly commercialized and publicized you would see how things have changed and not all for the better.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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These are the same people who are going to want to practice only to look cool and when someone comes along who are better they get uptight about it.

 

Oh man, I would love to watch people better than me in person! I want to learn from them! I think that's a good sign.

 

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A couple of years ago, when I found out Fordham had an annual talent show, I half thought about what my talents were, and what I could possibly do for it. Glowsticking is certainly on the list of talents, so for once I allowed myself to entertain the thought (I hadn't thought about it thoroughly before, because G.S.C has strict anti-talent-show rules, and I always agreed with them.) I found that, when I thought about entering the show independently of the GSC rules, I felt firsthand exactly what the rules preach and all my intuition said it was a bad idea anyway.

 

I couldn't quite explain why at first. Sure, it would be memorable. Sure, it would probably be one of the more unique acts. But something about it felt awkward, if not downright wrong. I came to the conclusion that if I was to bring myself to do anything I learned from GSC or general rave culture in a talent show, it probably wouldn't involve glowsticks. If the show was absolutely mandatory (as some high school talent shows actually are), I'd rather substitute my glowstrings with poi, or else bust out some contact balls and do a number.

 

Why?

 

For the same reasons that were mentioned before - because I understand the subtleties of the stigmas and associations that are assigned to glowsticks. FACT: Glowsticks happen to be associated with drugs, irresponsibility, and all the undesirable qualities in youth culture.

 

It is difficult to explain but the gut intuition goes something like this: When something has a negative stigma to begin with, people start with a negative or distorted perception of what you are doing, and it is difficult to work your way through or change this (even with conversation) until the stigma is removed, altered, or forgotten as a whole. This is especially difficult in front of a large audience, especially a large audience of people who have not been exposed to sticks outside of the "raver" context.

 

A further difficulty would be that glowsticking is not for everyone, so it is unwise to assume that everyone will see the same things you do in the art or your performance. I know for a fact that even turning on trance music is enough to make 7 out of 10 people uncomfortable (as America is dominated by rock and hip hop music, many people do not understand music past this), and discomfort leads to misunderstanding. This is why we glowstick in settings where we know it's accepted and appreciated. It is just more comfortable in an appropriate setting. Glowsticking in front of some indie-loving activist theater kids will bring the same reaction as teaching physics in the ghetto. Some people have completely different values. There is a time and a place.

 

Several of you have made the "but what if someone sees it at the show and likes it and joins and follows the culture" argument. The truth is that, just like the raves of the past, word of mouth and friends are much more reliable ways for this to happen, rather than watching it at a talent show. Think about if your first impression of sticking wasn't at a party but at a show where the person was onstage- you would associate the art as something solely for display and attention, meant to entertain, without any of the positive traits we encourage - that of community, friends, and acceptance. It is easy to become enticed by this.

 

Furthermore, using sticks at a talent show would make me feel as if I am taking the community, culture, and ideals and throwing caution to the wind, self ishly using the art to briefly and momentarily make myself funkey/flashy in the minds of total strangers who may not even understand it fully.

 

Lastly, just because of the nature of sticking, (it is different and flashy) when you stick in an auditorium, next to people who are doing conventional performances (music, acting, common types dancing) you automatically make a point of it. This is problematic for several reasons, one of which is that you are immediately making a contrast between sticking and conventional forms of performance, and whether or not you like it, making a statement about their nature. This could be taken to mean that you are placing sticking "above" other forms of expression, or perhaps that you are placing yourself above others in the competition, which is Not What G.S.C Is About.

 

BTW:

You can disagree, you can agree, these are just *my* thoughts, and me typing out my own train of thought about performing at a school show. Enjoy.~

 

 

 

 

 

As an aside-

I mentioned before that I'd rather use poi. I don't mean that I would encourage poi in a talent show either, but I think it's important to note why they feel *more* acceptable than glowsticks just to make some distinctions. Some people would argue that poi aren't vastly different, have hippie association, and are also unacceptable at a school talent show. However (at least to me) they are different. This is because poi:

 

a. are less known to the general public, and have less or inexistent social stigma, which leads to-

b. the fact that they are easier to have a conversation about (poi is an ancient art, and I find that telling people that allows for a sort of 'mystique' which validates it in their eyes), which leads to-

c. poi is generally seen as more 'mature'

 

All of those would allow for a more comfortable performance.

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I'm new here, so I don't know all the guidelines yet (I specifically say guidelines not rules to prevent negative/fanatic connotations to the culture) but I must say, I absolutely love this essay. It has however left me with two questions:

1) Am I allowed to copy this and put it on my hyves? (hyves is a facebook-like internetsite) Or do you, the author and other more senior members, believe that this is a bad thing.

2) lets say, purely theoretical, that for instance one of my relatives died (no this did NOT happen, it's just a scenario). If I wanted to show her my last respect by glowstringing in church or in the graveyard (and yes, I do realize the problems with glowstringing in church but that aside) would I be allowed to do this? Or would the veteran members also believe this to be a way of attracting the wrong kind of attention?

Anyway, I hope to hear your thoughts soon

Cheers

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I'm new here, so I don't know all the guidelines yet (I specifically say guidelines not rules to prevent negative/fanatic connotations to the culture) but I must say, I absolutely love this essay. It has however left me with two questions:

1) Am I allowed to copy this and put it on my hyves? (hyves is a facebook-like internetsite) Or do you, the author and other more senior members, believe that this is a bad thing.

 

First of all welcome.... I am responding to your post because the beginning of it touched on what i was going to post..... I have been a member of gsc for almost a year and I have only within the last few weeks, started REALLY reading on the culture and trying to understand it better! This article NEEDS to be given to EVERY new member as a standard "welcome letter"..... is that even possible.... I think it would help in the refrain of a lot of discord!!!! THanks for this post Cleric!!!

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Love this post Cleric and I learned alot from it, I am very new to the glowsticking community and am learning alot about it and thank you for posting this and I totally agree.

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I as well totaly agree with all of that...im not gonna lie, I got into glowsticking because I saw a kid at school doing it but unlike the normal high school kid, I actualy thought it was beautiful. The way the sticks spin and flow sparked my intrest...and now that I have gotten more into it I realize that the kid was with GxG because I remember him mentioning their saying which I cant recall atm lol.

 

but anyways, I am still new to this community (started today lol) but even before today I learned about PLUR from people I met on youtube like Guinto and Icy (great people btw thanks for the help if you ever read this :D ) and I suport everything aobut it and hope someday I can be as influencial to this community as all of you are

 

<3

Shaw :)

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Guest Anthony7xD
ummm eddy

 

=(

 

you got to give credit on the skills though

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I don't have to give credit on anything.

 

It's been stated already you can get "good" by practicing and spending the time to learn new things and think outside the box.

 

Out of all the posts in this thread. You choose that one to quote.... and then say what you said.

 

Explain yourself.

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Personally I see him as an instigator. His started threads have been self promoting his videos and his other posts are almost all about crews, high school or public performance. I'm personally tired of people coming to our community and dumping shit everywhere. I don't come to your house clog your toilets and urinate in your potted plants...don't make posts for the sake of kicking dirt.

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Everyone should feel free to speak their mind. But once they realize they arent here for the right reasons or don't agree with our stances they should just do the mature thing and leave.

 

 

 

I mean. I notice a lot that goes on. If i don't then someone else does and then I hear about it.

 

I mean.. come on. What a fucking joke.

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